NEVER vaccinate an animal under stress or anaesthesia!

[Tobi]

This is a two-year old blog post on Dogs4Dogs.com
It's not about a dog, but aTiger cub who was vaccinated while under anaesthesia, and the cub died suddenly from anaphylactic shock:
http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2016/01/23...lls-tiger/

It is by now well known that any animal either under stress, under anaesthesia, or during surgery, should NEVER be vaccinated. Yet many vets still do this, I presume for convenience.

A warning. The vet may not mention it, but we have to educate ourselves and insist on what we want nowadays.

[Catherine]

I have never heard about this.
I have seen vets vaccinate anesthetized animals, but that was 40 years ago. I hope we have all learned a lot since then.

What a sad loss of a tiger and so unnecessary. I notice that the vet decided to go against the manufacturer's instructions. I would think that the people who make the vaccines must know something about them and if they say not to do something it is for a reason. It is easier to vaccinate an unconscious animal, but that is not sufficient reason for endangering its life.


It would be horrible to lose a beloved pet because a vet cut corners. They do cut corners. A vet I once knew wanted to save time and he gave a pill to a dog who was  starting to wake up after surgery. He popped the pill in the side of the unconscious dog's mouth and the dog quickly closed its mouth taking part of the vet's finger off with its sharp side teeth. It was a reflex action and it was sudden and strong. The vet lost a lot more time at the hospital having his own surgery. He should have waited for the dog to wake up.

[Tobi]

Maybe people didn't know this, but the companies who manufacture vaccines are exempt from legal action against them. I had a link to that subject the other day and lost it, but if I find that again I'll post it.
Now why would that be so?
And the ingredients of all vaccines, for humans and animals, are dubious to say the least.
I am not saying vaccines shouldn't be used. They do a lot of good when used appropriately. But our animals (pets) should NOT be vaccinated once yearly with a combination vaccine.

[Catherine]

I didn't know vaccine manufacturers were exempt from legal action. I wonder why that happened. I hope you find the link.
I know there have been cases of defective vaccines that caused illness. On the whole vaccines are still a valuable thing. I keep certain shots up to date. I have not bothered with the flu shot. Every year I think about it. Last year when I had the flu it was a strain not covered by the shot. This year the really bad strain is not covered by the shot. So why bother.

I don't know what is going on with animal vaccines right now. I just know that a rabies shot is important depending on where you live. I would want a pet to have that vaccine here since there are cases of rabies.

So what is the issue with the yearly combination vaccine. I am not even sure what is in it these days.

[platy]

Interesting. I'll have to ask about this at work and see what they say.

[Catherine]

I wonder if different countries are using different combinations of vaccines. That might make a difference.
I don't even know what vaccines are being used on dogs and cats these days.

Let us know if you find out anything.

[Tobi]

The ruling is from 2011, I believe, but is still operational in the US.:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con...06008.html

 I think  in Europe vaccine manufacturers can still be sued. I am not quite sure but read something to that effect.
But not so in the US. But there is a special government fund for vaccine injury, paid for by tax on immunisations. I think that simply HAD to be set up, as claims for injury are not as rare as some would have us think! But that is not connected at all to the manufacturers, who remain exempt.
That basically means they are "above the Law".
Now who finds that very strange indeed? I know I do.

For dogs the combination vaccine (recommended as a yearly booster):
Distemper
Adenovirus-2 (Hepatitis)
Parvo virus
Parainfluenza
(“DHPP,” “DA2PP,” “DHPPV,” or “DA2PPV”)
Of course often the Rabies vaccine is included, and the Leptosirosis one.

These and sometimes other elements also are given as one shot. Yearly most often.
Same dose no matter if the dog weighs 4lbs or 110lbs!

I am unsure about cats.

I always preferred "Titer Testing" over yearly boosters. I chose that when Misty had a very bad reaction to her booster shots one time, and the connection was denied by the vet, when to me it was simply obvious. The Titer testing revealed that even more than 3 years after receiving her last Distemper vaccination, she remained immune (or with a strong enough immunity.) She was also immune to Parvo. In fact she showed healthy immunity to all the others (discounting Rabies as we were in the UK) -except Leptospirosis, which the vet told me, did not "titer" well at all. So I let her have the single shot.

I liked that vet and trusted him. He helped Misty a lot. But he DID innoculate her with the Lepto while she was under anaesthetic. I knew nothing about risks then. And he seemed to have no grasp of what constituted a "bad vaccine reaction" that few years previously.
(Vomiting, diarrhea, confusion, anorexia, fever, and inability to walk for 3 days. From healthy full of energy and well, to being that ill hours after the innoculation. The clinic said it must be co-incidental. I knew it wasn't.)

I was also very ill in 1992 for approximately a year after receiving the full course of Tetanus vaccines; a three month course. My immune system was shot to pieces. But I got better.

[Catherine]

The whole vaccine issue is very complicated. Some children have been harmed by defective vaccines or reactions to vaccines. 
However there is a movement to blame vaccines for autism. Studies continue to show that there is no link between vaccination and autism. 
I think the law is meant to prevent parents from going after the manufacturers of vaccines. There is already a movement against vaccination and children who should have been vaccinated are now dying of things like measles. Unfortunately the law prevents parents whose children were hurt from seeking compensation. I would also fear that drug companies knowing they are legally immune will be less vigilant about their products.

We know vaccine reactions happen in animals. You are lucky that Misty was strong enough to recover. Having her tested for immunity was safer than continuing to vaccinate her. You were lucky to have a good vet even though he couldn't make the obvious connection.


We gave a litter of pure bred Siamese kittens their second shots. I think they were 8 or 10 weeks old and very healthy. Two of them died within hours. The other two were very ill. It was as if they had all the diseases at once. The little female died days later.
The male must have been strong. He had high fevers, open running sores, ulcers in the mouth and seizures. That is what I can remember. He recovered, but I use the word cautiously. He was brain damaged and physically impaired. He had no coordination and could trip just walking across the floor. He was clearly mentally challenged. It left him very simple minded. If a door was closed he would just look at it blankly until I opened it. I don't think he understood the concept of door. There was the space he could walk through and sometimes there was the "wall". If he waited long enough the walk through space reappeared. He never made the connection that I opened the door. He was like that about everything. He was totally loveable and he lived the rest of his life with me. He never got any better.
The vet would not believe it was the vaccine. All four vaccinated kittens were effected. There was a fifth kitten in the litter who was already with someone else and who received the second vaccine elsewhere. That kitten was fine.

You make a good point about dosage. Since dogs vary so much in size how can they think one size fits all. 
I have the same problem with medication. It isn't just dosage, I react at a much lower dose to most things.  Doctors won't compensate for that. Medications don't work well for me because the dosage is too much.

That seems like a long course of tetanus vaccines. No wonder you reacted. Our bodies are not meant to receive large amounts of any medication. In nature plants contain very low doses of things that we now receive in pill form.

I know we need vaccines. I wouldn't want to go back to the days of epidemics. We need to be cautious and we need to follow safety guidelines like not vaccinating anesthetized  animals.

[platy]

Here we have core (recommended vaccination) and non-core (optional, can be geographically based) vaccines for cats and dogs.

Core includes
Dogs : canine distemper virus, canine adenovirus and canine parvovirus.

Cats: feline parvovirus, feline calicivirus and feline herpesvirus.

Non-core
Dogs: parainfluenza virus, Bordetella bronchiseptica and Leptospira interrogans.

Cats: feline leukaemia virus, Chlamydia felis and Bordetella bronchiseptica.

However. Even if you do vaccinate, cats and dogs can still get these diseases. The infection should just be less severe.
But, diseases like canine distemper are relatively rare occurrences here because of vaccination.

Tetanus is a main vaccination for horses. And luckily we dont have to worry about rabies.

[Catherine]

Thank-you for the vaccine update. Some of the vaccines didn't exist last time I had a cat.

We lost a number of cats to the  feline leukaemia virus in the 70s.  Sadly it was unknown and there was no vaccine. I am glad that cats have protection now.

You are lucky to be rabies free. It is a terrible disease and it does transmit to unvaccinated pets and humans. If you get bitten by an unknown animal there is always a risk.